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My take on the SSS problem

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My take on the SSS problem

Post Tue May 20, 2014 2:52 pm

Hey! This is my attempt on this sss experiment. Something like soap. It's a blend material that consist a rough glass with maximum roughness and the IOR=4,1 or something like that, that's silicone's IOR; and a glossy material.

SSSsoap.png
bar of soap

SSSsoapmonkey.png
soap monkey
jarmaizsolt
 
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Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Thu May 29, 2014 1:33 pm

Hi that looks quite nice for a silicone material.
How does it look under "normal" lighting conditions like sun and sky for example?
Could you please share your material setup?
And is rough glass better than shinydiffuse with translucency?
Ninetycho
 
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Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Mon Jun 02, 2014 2:52 pm

Hey! I'm not at the computer on which I have this file, but basically it's nothing special, I've just blended the rough glass and a glossy material. Rough glass seems better to me than a translucent material (I've been experimenting with that a lot, didn't work) because of the refraction I guess. It tends to have less strange things than translucent which doest't care about the direction of light and the distance of the entering surface and the exiting surface, of course I'm not an expert but I'm guessing it might be the reason. I'll test it in normal lighting conditions, or if you would do so please post the result here, I'm quite interested too, just don't really have time nowadays. It is possible that it wouldn't act perfectly but who knows... I've also realised that under IOR ~4 it doesn't work. But silicone is the closest thing to skin that I found on an IOR list. Give it a try! I'm interested in your results!!
jarmaizsolt
 
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Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Mon Jun 02, 2014 8:28 pm

Thanks for the tips i will give it a try^^
Ninetycho
 
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Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Tue Jun 03, 2014 6:02 pm

Did some tests with it on a female I am working on.

I used an IOR of 4.6 in the rough glass. I do not know if this is correct but it looked ok to me.
And I had to add an inner mesh of that body that i already had with a shinydiffuse material with an almost pure red color and a lot of translucency otherwise it looked not like skin(i can post that if someone wants).
With that red mesh inside it gets this red color in the shaded areas(like inbetween the legs).

It is not the best skin but it is a start.
Attachments
Skin_Light_Setups.jpg
Ninetycho
 
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Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Tue Jun 03, 2014 6:58 pm

Patience...
exporterSSS.png
povmaniac
 
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Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Wed Jun 04, 2014 1:00 pm

@Ninetycho
I think it looks quite decent, yeah I thought that there would be some trincky thing to get it work in this light scenario, I've also tried the inner mesh thing with the solidify modifier, and have added a red material to the inner mesh, didn't work out perfectly for me. But yours looks ok. Anothe thing I've tried to mimic inner colour is to decrease IOR extremly, this way filter colour goes far behind the surface, because of the lack of big refraction I guess. Then you set the filter colour of the rough glass to a redish one, and set the reflection colour an the abs. colour to the skin colour, and you mix the whole thing with a glossy mat with skin colour. Here is a screenshot of the rough glass, the blend mat, and the result.
skinrough.PNG
skin rough glass

skinblend.PNG
skin blend shader

skinn.png
skinmonkey


@povmaniac
Great news! We can try workarounds till then though, can't we? :D If sss arrives (which I don't really use actually as I usually have to render buildings; just experimenting with it), my only wish will be displacement and we're done (ok.. maybe multiple uv-s... and irradiance cache.. but that's all :D maybe I'm a bit greedy)

Zsolt
jarmaizsolt
 
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Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Wed Jun 04, 2014 1:17 pm

oh and one with sunsky2, and with skylight and a sun lamp
skinsunsky2.png
sunsky2

skinsun.png
sunlamp+sky


maybe Is hould should have made filter colour more red, dunno.. or put more of the roughlass in the blend mat... anyway this is where I got so far.

Zsolt
jarmaizsolt
 
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Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Wed Jun 04, 2014 3:41 pm

Interesting test from blend option. You can share the render times, please? In the actual state of SSS integration, the render is a bit slowly..:(
povmaniac
 
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Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Wed Jun 04, 2014 5:24 pm

Well the good thing in this method, that it is quite fast. Ok it's just one Suzanne and a plane in my scene, and the resolution is not that big, but these were rendered in 1-2 maybe 3 minutes, didn't check that, on a 2core intel cpu using Photon Mapping, I guess it's quite ok. Yes, I understand that coding a thing like SSS must be a difficult task. I don't know if you can get tips from other open source stuff, because for example Appleseed renderer has a great Fast SSS material, maybe you could check that.
jarmaizsolt
 
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Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Wed Jun 04, 2014 9:13 pm

After seeing that image of SSS integration I felt like a fool thanks for that^^
Just joking, that is awesome news thank you povmaniac.

But I still keep trying until real SSS is integrated ;D

jarmaizsolt you are a kind of a genius. That is a pretty nice rough glass setup. And the renders are looking great. I think there is just a little too much reflection.
So I used your setup and changed things like IOR to 0.9(it gives me less reflections and less red refractions) and reduced roughness to 0.86(looked kind of smoother than 1).
And I do not need an inner mesh anymore.
(FYI the model and textures are from makehuman(the old version))

I got just one problem with that unsmoothed edges again(ear)...

And as always: raw rendering and some photoshop color adjustments on the rendering.
Attachments
Skin_2_Material_Setups.jpg
Material Setup
Skin_2_Light_Setups.jpg
Renderings
Ninetycho
 
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Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:03 pm

Looks great!! Yeah, my renders might not be so realistic, usually I don't render people. And thank you for your kind words :D that second mesh thing made me crazy too. I think this is a working solution, until SSS arrives, from that on we could keep it as a second choice if SSS won't be fast enough in its beginning, but I'm sure after a while this cool feature will be another thing that makes Yafa even more greater.
jarmaizsolt
 
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Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2013 4:43 pm

Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Thu Jun 05, 2014 9:40 pm

The Blend material trick is really interesting and it looks very convincing... almost like Fast SSS in Blender Engine. The subsurface scattering branch worked fine 3 years ago but it was a little slow. But considering that my tests were made with an insanely massive 3d model, It would be interesting to try the Blend trick with big models too... Now povmaniaco is trying to bring SSS back with some fixes so hopefully we'll have 2 methods to compare soon. :D
Attachments
sss_final01.png
sss02.png

"Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men."

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condar
 
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Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Sun Dec 07, 2014 8:45 pm

I just had to do some more tests on that subject, because i wasn't really satisfied, because of the matter that the absorption did not work with blend materials(and the glossy reflections from the glossy material were not really smooth i think).
So I rendered them seperately and mixed them in Blenders compositor. There are the same materials as above, but i changed some parameters in the rough glass material.
Attachments
_Skin_02.jpg
Skin New Backlight
_Skin_01.jpg
Skin New
_Skin_Old.jpg
Old Skin - Blend Material(with IOR 1.44 in Rough Glass)
Ninetycho
 
Posts: 55
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:33 pm

Re: My take on the SSS problem

Post Thu Apr 09, 2015 7:34 am

Hey! Here are some sss tests. These are rendered with bounty renderer, which is a fork of yafa developed by povmaniac, and it has sss. Should try that for skin!
Image
Image
jarmaizsolt
 
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