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2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

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2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:32 am

Hi,
I've not followed Yafaray development recently, but I've just seen the "Yafaray Features Demo" video , and it seem there is subsurface scattering, so I'm interested to support it in makehuman.

Question 1:

Is Yafaray available only as Blender and XSI plugin? There is not a standalone version?

Question 2:

I've not found sss topics on this site. Where can I find more info (and renderings, if possible) about sss in Yafaray?

Best,

Manuel Bastioni
(Makehuman admin)
Manuel
 
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:37 am

Hi Manuel

There is a photonmapping based SSS shader as a result of a GSoC project, but it needs review and testing, and it is not yet on the official trunk. The one you saw on the features video is a hack, it a translucent multilayered object.

YafaRay has been always a stand alone program, but if you are planning to add it to Makehuman, better use the YafaRay API as the Blender and XSI exporter do, this will spare you the intermediate and many times expensive xml export.
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Samo
 
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Mon Aug 29, 2011 1:26 pm

Hi Samo, thanks for reply.

It's embarrassing for me, but I can't find the download for the standalone version (http://www.yafaray.org/download1):
Table of Content

YafaRay 0.1.2 Beta 2 for Blender 2.5.
YafaRay 0.1.1 stable for Blender 2.49b.
YafaRay 0.1.2 Beta 2 for Autodesk Softimage XSI.
...


Can you point me to the right place?

About sss. I don't care if it's physically correct or just a fake. What we need is a way to have a good skin rendering. There is someone that has successfuly used the translucent multilayered object in order to obtain a realistic character (in your experience...) ?

Best,

Manuel
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Mon Aug 29, 2011 4:39 pm

Manuel

It does not make sense to release it as stand-alone because there are not users for such a version. However, in YafaRay binaries folder there is an utility called yafaray-xml.exe which will accept yafaray xml scenes as input. That utility is used in a commands terminal. However, that method is not the recommended way to make you application to use the yafaray engine, as there is an API to feed your application output directly into yafaray, this is the method used by the Blender and the XSI exporter.

About the SSS shader, my advice is to use and improve the photonmapping based SSS shader. If you are interested, please help us to get it finished.

More info at
http://www.yafaray.org/community/forum/ ... =24&t=3528
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:53 pm

Doesn't make sense a standalone?
This sound weird: it's what happen with Luxrender, Aqsis, Pixie, POVray, etc.. (and, of course, what happen with Houdini, 3delight, Maxwell, Vray, etc..).

Makehuman is developed in python (except a little, minimal core in C). For this reason I guess I can't use directly the API you suggest: they should be wrapped in python, and this require much more work that write a simple xml exporter.

I think, in my experience, that to have a "detached" version of the engine is fundamental for the diffusion of the software. If not, you lose the advantages of the good language of Yafaray scene. XML was an excellent choice in my opinion, but why a so flexible file if you have not an external engine?

If all software interested in Yafaray have to use the internal API, have the xml scene description is almost useless. In my opinion, of course.

About SSS. Of course I'm interested, but all our resources are busy with makehuman, as you can imagine...

Best,

Manuel
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:13 pm

Manuel,

The Yafaray plug-in for wings3d uses the yafaray-xml.exe program to render the xml file that wings3d exports.

I agree that it would be better to be able to download a version of Yafaray that is pure Yafaray without any Blender files. The way it is now causes confusion for people who want to use Yafaray but do not use Blender. I think the reason for the way it is now is that all the coders working on Yafaray are Blender users.

The SSS Shader works very good. You have to download the special SSS build that is in the thread that Samo listed in his post. You can see some examples of SSS which I created in Wings3d at the end of the thread.

oort
Last edited by oort on Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:21 pm

The release policy is going to be reviewed anyway, I will talk with developers about your request for a stand alone release.
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:36 pm

You can still compile Yafaray from source and thus have a standalone installation which uses the command line to read xml & render it. I don't know on Windows, but on Linux is very easy to compile it and install.
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:18 pm

Samo wrote:The release policy is going to be reviewed anyway, I will talk with developers about your request for a stand alone release.


Thanks. The standalone is very important for Yafaray diffusion, imho. It's a classic way for all engines I know.

@ _Mo_
We need something official. Usually we don't include the external engines in makehuman package, but we point the users to download latest stable version of the supported engine, from the main site (this is good to promote the engine, also). So it's better to avoid unofficial-custom builds.


@ oort

Thanks. We can use yafaray-xml.exe in meantime, for testing, but it would be much better to have the main version, for the same reasons written above...

Best,

Manuel
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Tue Aug 30, 2011 5:19 am

oort wrote:
I agree that it would be better to be able to download a version of Yafaray that is pure Yafaray without any Blender files. The way it is now causes confusion for people who want to use Yafaray but do not use Blender. I think the reason for the way it is now is that all the coders working on Yafaray are Blender users.

oort


Well ... that's not quite true.
Although I am a user of Blender, Softimage is my usual software (in the Mod Tool version 7.5). This was the main reason for created the exporter.
I agree that we should use, whenever possible, the API YafaRay, being the most powerful and flexible. But, I also agree, to maintain the XML option to allow users of other software, can use YafaRay.
Greetings..
P D: Sorry for my english...
povmaniaco
 
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Tue Nov 22, 2011 12:21 am

I also would like to say that a standalone version of Yafaray would be greatly welcomed and would contribute to its diffusion as well. Any chance to know if you guys are working on it? Thanks
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:08 am

Just an option to see the framebuffer during xml rendering would help us in Yafamax too :wink:
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:38 am

Hi, I am new arround here!

I just wanted to tell that I am using the standalone yafaray-xml too. In my case, I am doing some project for c# Net Framework, and it's much easier for me to write an xml than to write a binding wrapper for yafaray Api.

Ideally, I would preffer to use an official NET binding, but since such a thing does not exists, the next best thing is to write the XML.

So far it's been working pretty well, and it helps keep things separated, so please, keep supporting the stand-alone version!

Cheers

Vic
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Thu Feb 09, 2012 12:20 pm

I can assure you, maintained support for stand-alone version of Yafaray.
I'm preparing some new things. You will, news soon.
Greetings..
PD: Vic = Vic-Osona-Barcelona-Catalunya-España? A ver si somos vecinos..:)
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Re: 2 quest. :Yafaray as standalone and sss

Post Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:56 pm

povmaniaco wrote:I can assure you, maintained support for stand-alone version of Yafaray.
I'm preparing some new things. You will, news soon.
Greetings..
PD: Vic = Vic-Osona-Barcelona-Catalunya-España? A ver si somos vecinos..:)


That's good to know; I've been using the latest beta binaries, and I was wondering when they would be released; it's been a long time since the latest official version.

PD: Casi, de Valencia ;)
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