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YafaRay Usability Lab

Post here general questions about usage of YafaRay and about the Blender Exporter UI

YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Mon Nov 16, 2009 9:18 am

This thread is for complaining about YafaRay User Interfaces usability in a constructive and diplomatic way, and for proposing good and imaginative solutions to coders.

Since a new integration has to be coded for Blender 2.5 and beyond, I believe we should not rush this new integration tasks, and have a good debate about YafaRay usability before, so we don't export the current UI mistakes to the new interface.

Links about usability:
http://www.useit.com/papers/heuristic/h ... _list.html
http://www.asktog.com/basics/firstPrinciples.html
http://www.nngroup.com/reports/
http://www.zenhaiku.com/archives/usabil ... _life.html
http://books.google.com/books?id=o1IqPH0a2fYC
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Samo
 
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Re: YafaRay Usability

Post Tue Nov 24, 2009 5:06 pm

Here it goes:

1-Pathtracing has the caustics method a litle bit hidden ( none by default ) new users may find it dificult to find or understand. I suggest some subtitle in the dropdown like : caustics method

2-It wold by nice to work with the file and the yafaray interface while a render is beeing processed without the xml method. Does anyone agree?
Manuel_Ramos
 
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Re: YafaRay Usability

Post Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:18 pm

based on the povray integration example of 2.5, settings such as materials and things for external renderers can be in the native blender tabs. will this be the case for the new yafaray exporter or will it be more like it is now? I guess both systems have their own advantages so either way is ok.
loh
 
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Re: YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Wed Nov 25, 2009 11:52 pm

Hi guys, thanks for your suggestions.

First of all, I have compiled a list of links about usability and I have posted them in the first message.
Secondly, maybe this is not the best way to talk about it, since usabilily has got a very important empirical factor, an usability test should be created for beginners, and many usabilty questions require a new general approach rather than patches here and there.

Anyway here we can disscuss about the most evident cases. For instance:
AA inc. samples and AA Thresold should be enabled only if AA passes > 1
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Re: YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Thu Nov 26, 2009 10:36 am

I´m not sure if this is the right place to say this, but here I go...

I think it should be a WORLD settings for each SETTING configuration, like in the old Yafaray.
I usually make two configuration settings, for example, one with a low configuration with Direct Lighting and another with Pathtracing. As you all know, Background Lights work different for each method of lighting, so for me is just annoying because everytime I change between my render sets, I have to change Background Settings.

This would be unnecesary if we could have one Background Settings for each Render Sets.

Other times, I just want to have a day and night light configuration in the same blend archive. With the "old way" it was something really easy, but now is not possible as you can only have one background configuration.

I imagine there was some reason to change this. I like tath we have one tab for the WORLD configuration (now the Setting window is not sooo long), but I think it would be better if this configuration was depending on the Render Set I´m using.

I don´t know if you guys think the way I do, but I think this way would be more comfortable.

Greetings
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Arkinauta
 
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Re: YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Thu Nov 26, 2009 10:59 am

the problem was that a combined window with render settings and background settings took much space, maybe it would be better to make 'background' sets, like render settings sets.
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Samo
 
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Re: YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Thu Nov 26, 2009 11:04 am

It could be a very interesting discussion, and perfectly on time for the future 2.5 “integration”.

What would be great and easier is to have the ability to copy/paste the materials (and not, just the colors).
Presets for different materials would be more user friendly for beginners too.

+1 for the backgrounds sets, brilliant idea.
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bupla
 
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Re: YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Tue Dec 01, 2009 6:49 pm

Maybe someone tells me I missed it, but the most simple one...

- ability to save and restore render settings from one blend file to another as well as set global/universal settings, which can be restored from any blend file anytime...
Kunden-besser-informieren.de

Images posted by me are solely posted for the purpose of the yafaray project. Any other commercial or non-commercial use, modification etc. of my images and its content requires my written permission.
heretic
 
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Re: YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Thu Dec 03, 2009 12:31 pm

Samo wrote:
Anyway here we can disscuss about the most evident cases. For instance:
AA inc. samples and AA Thresold should be enabled only if AA passes > 1


Committed on current experimental branch ;D

Other things I fixed:
- exporter panel scroll stop when top or bottom are reached so exporter desn't go "away" when you scroll too much
- current render set saved into blend file so when you open it next time it will use last set
Michele Castigliego
ALTASIS - http://www.altasis.it
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subcomandante
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Re: YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Fri Dec 04, 2009 1:57 am

The decision to resample is based the difference in value of the pixels. This can require a high number of initial samples to smooth out the noise in dark areas that does not get resampled. Although the additive difference is below the threshold it still looks noisy because to some extent the eye judges changes on proportional difference.

This would fix the problem of noisy dark areas as well as decrease the over sampling that happens in very light areas that already appear smooth.
loh
 
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Re: YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Mon Dec 07, 2009 2:47 pm

Samo wrote:the problem was that a combined window with render settings and background settings took much space, maybe it would be better to make 'background' sets, like render settings sets.


I have a patch to commit where YafaRay backgrounds are linked to blender Worlds, so if you want to add/select several backgrounds just add/select blender worlds, each world will have it's own YafaRay background.

UPDATE:
The patch was committed on experimental repo, how it works:
Before there was one single yafaray background setting for each blend file.
On current revision each blender world setup a different yafaray background setting so you can:
1. Add as many world in blender and get as many yafaray background settings you want
2. Append or link as many blender world as you want using blender usual way and get yafaray background settings inherited too.

What does it means?
You can setup a blend file with several world, adjust yafaray background settings for each of them and save it. Link those world into a new blend file and use it as a background library.


I'm using similar approach to improve the Settings tab.
Currently you have only 4 sets in exporter (Set 1 ... Set 4) and all scenes use them.
With new approach you can:
1. Add/Delete as many yafaray render sets as you want
2. Each render sets will be linked to blender scene selected so you can have on each scene a different set
3. Link those scenes from another blend file and use the yafaray render set of that scene into your local scene.
This way you could setup a blend file with several "presets" and link them from another blend file to use them as a library.

Who wants to test the latter can download the experimental exporter from http://www.soulbit.net/yafaray-blender.zip
The exporter will work only with current experimental yafaray version (formerly 0.1.2)
This patch is not completed yet but it will work.
Known issues:
1. Render sets with same name are badly managed
2. No sorting

Hope you like this.
Michele Castigliego
ALTASIS - http://www.altasis.it
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Re: YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Wed Dec 09, 2009 2:17 am

Hey, this looks interesting. It seems to work too.....

I'll play with it some more, thanks subcommandante :)
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stoneage
 
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Re: YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Wed Dec 09, 2009 6:26 pm

subcomandante wrote:- current render set saved into blend file so when you open it next time it will use last set


This is REALLY handy :)
Thanks Subcomandante!

I like a lot the new features!
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Arkinauta
 
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Re: YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Sat Dec 12, 2009 8:59 pm

I believe the 'Glossy as diffuse' button should be available only if photon mapping setting is used, people like enabling that button for no reason
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Samo
 
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Re: YafaRay Usability Lab

Post Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:40 pm

Now that I´m using Corefarm quite often, it would be nice if the xml exporter could give an automatic name (similar like the one you get with Auto Save enabled) to the xml archive.

I know this is not a killer feature (you can change the name manually), but it will be handy.
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